30 New Year, New Goals, New Perspective?


Hillary:  Welcome to Loose Leaf, a multi-author writing journal, where we talk goals, the ups and downs of writing and where we try to warn you off our greatest pitfalls, we'll keep it short because you don't have much time and we'd rather be writing. Happy 20, 21. 

Charity: It's a new year. I hope it's better than last year. Right. 

Hillary: So, I mean, I don't see how a day is going to change the thing it's like birthdays is wake up and say, Oh, excellent.

Music: I still 

Hillary: feel exactly the same as yesterday. Okay. Hopefully crossing fingers. Sure. I'll be positive 

Charity: for you. So I did want to, uh, run something by you guys. I know the last time we met, we talked a little bit about wanting to do a patriotic and I set all this stuff up and we worked out the levels of what was on it.

And the more I think about it, the more I really don't want to do it. Are you guys 

Music: okay with that? I mean, 

Charity: I love the things we came up with. I love the idea with it. The idea behind it. But to be honest, it's just so much more work that's right, 

Hillary: right. He hit a point where we decided we need to, then we can do it, but you know what?

It's just, it is, it's just extra work right now. 

Charity: It's extra work and I'm not doing this really for sales or marketing. And my husband's at a great mood right now. He's like, well, just pay the fee for the RSSP hosting. And it's not really a big deal. Since zoom is working and our microphones and stuff are working.

There's really not anything else I think we need to cover. 

Hillary: So. All right. 

Charity: Yay. Undo it and pause it. I'll leave it there in case we ever decide to come back, but. That that's a load off my mind. Well, I, so I did do something else kind of instead today I created the group nested underneath the loose-leaf podcast, Facebook page, I think a sent calendar invite.

And I think isn't, you went to Hillary. It's on Facebook, it's on Facebook and it's just going to be a writer supporting writers group. And so I haven't done anything. I invited a few people that popped up in my list right away, but basically it'll just be more of the chat area where people can get together and decide if they want to swap for critiques or if they have specific questions about.

Hey, I really need to learn how to get my verb tenses to match up and we can have like little discussions and I thought, what am I do over the next couple of months is I'll do all the research and you can do units where it's like little lessons. And so I would do one on verb tense agreement, maybe on point of view.

And just whenever I can put one up, I will, you guys don't have to worry about doing any of that. But it's mostly, it's like an online writers' group. That's just open 24 seven for people to get on and interact 

Hillary: sounds like more work than the 

Charity: Patriot though. I have to do the work. Other people can come on and ask a question and then other people can answer questions.

So, right. So creating 

Kahle: a space for

Charity: the leaf pile. Yes. Yes. So our leaf pile we'll move to that 

Hillary: Facebook. Oh, there it is. I was looking for loose-leaf author podcast, invited you to join this group. I will join. 

Charity: I think we only had one person there when I looked earlier. Uh, and she was coming to our writer's group here.

And then of course we have not been right. Uh, we have not been meeting for writers groups. So Hillary, would you like to introduce what we're going to talk about today? Cause we liked your idea of talking about, 

Music: I didn't know 

Hillary: what you guys had agreed on there. I could talk about stuff like, yeah. I had two things there.

I don't know what told me cause they were kind of similar. 

Charity: Yeah. Well I think they go well together. You said something about, um, talking about what makes. Each genre unique or how we keep things believable. Yeah. Like by not being too convenient, having realistic dialogue, 

Hillary: which one are we doing? They seem pretty different to me.


Charity: I think John Mara has kind of slightly different rules about what makes it believable. 

Hillary: Okay. So we're talking about the believable one really is what it is. Yeah. 

Charity: Okay. So when you were saying as well, kale, cause that's what I thought. 

Hillary: Yeah. Okay. So we're talking about how we keep our writing believable.

Music: That's so good.

Charity: Does anybody feel like jumping in? I know Kayla sounds like you have some ideas about how you keep your adventure writing believable says for Dungeons and dragons. 

Kahle: Yeah. So.

And in books that I've read and, um, and adventures that I have written and played through their needs. It's to be, so-so what makes fantasy believable, I think is the, uh, the law size, I guess, is the word one way to put it the, the imaginary things. That get you to buy into this world in this universe. Um, whenever the characters see something that to you is very strange, but to them is commonplace.

All of a sudden the reader has a decision to make well. Is that, is that weird to me? Or am I, I feel like it's inviting the reader or in D and D it's inviting the player to buy in, to buy into the story. 

Charity: And that's what gives it that fantasy feel that it is so 

Kahle: different and, and it it's what allows your brain to transport to another place rather than, um, it's, it's very similar.

I feel with, um, historical fiction where it's, what is real, makes it real. Yeah. You're reading historical fiction. And all of a sudden they're talking about this, this thing that maybe if you're really into historical fiction, like my wife is, um, you, you hear them talking about, uh, I'll, I'll use a film reference.

I'll use a film reference because it's the most recent one I've noticed the, uh, was it Amazon that made the new Emma? 

Charity: I haven't seen it yet. 

Hillary: I didn't know there was a new Emma 

Music: it's 

Kahle: fricking good.

Music: Okay. 

Kahle: I had a big problem with it. The first time I watched it, because how much is a 

Music: jerk?

Kahle: She is. She really is. What do you think about it? But I'm just so used to the, uh, the BBC one, the Mo the more recent BBC one. I love that one is my favorite one. Yeah. But this one was like, man, Emma is so bad 

Music: for these people she needs.

Kahle: Uh, but the, the historical accuracy in it really like buys buys in, in the beginning. You see it's nightly, right? You see nightly getting dressed. And it is like a process

and, uh, 

Music: COVID I find this fascinating 

Charity: that the guy of our group knows about the new Emma movie before the two 

Music: romance writers.

Hillary: little romance writer. Hart is going crazy here. Just try imagining these scenes 

Music: already 

Charity: hurry up and finish this podcast. I need to go and look at it. 

Kahle: You do, you do. It's good. It's really good. It's like, it's a good version. So. 

Charity: If the historical aspects really make it as what you're saying. 

Kahle: Yeah. Yeah. Like the clothes are exceptional.


Charity: let's see, this is gonna connect 

Hillary: to that too. I love that stuff. I follow so many, um, tailors and historical tailors on there's a guy called pin set, tailoring that does stuff on Instagram and it's incredible. He does all his stuff by hand. I love the historical stuff. I'm so someday, someday I will have a historically accurate.

Music: Regency dress.

Charity: I would 

Hillary: love that. I really would. I mean, I feel like that actually makes them look real is when you do all the layers, because if you just do the shell of the dress, It just looks like this shell of a dress, so yeah.

Charity: Yes. Go. I'm sorry that I interrupted you. Go for it. Oh, no, you're 

Kahle: fine. Um, did you guys watch the little clip I sent you? 

Hillary: Probably not. No, right now I'm doubting myself 

Charity: the Muppet Christmas. Carol. I have not 

Hillary: watched it. I've 

Charity: seen the whole movie, but I didn't see, I didn't watch the clip you 

Music: sent. Before he shot himself in for the night, she searched his rooms.

How do you know what Scrooge is doing down here and he's up there.

Kahle: And then he goes, Scrooge turned off, had to turn on the lights and the lights come on. No, it was just, it was just the comment of, uh, How do you know what's good. Cause Gonzo is playing Charles Dickens telling the story and he's like, how do you know what's going on? I keep telling you storytellers are on there.

Music: Yeah. But, uh, 

Kahle: anyway, the, the thing I was going to say about Muppet Christmas, Carol, is the costuming in that is pretty cool. Insane. I watched a 25 minute video of this lady who does like period piece sewing and costumes in the movie and was like freaking out about how all these puppet costumes 

Music: are.

Kahle: Perfect. Even in the flashback sequences, they flashback and they do the style from the period of the flashback. That's 

Music: awesome. Yeah, that's cool. 

Kahle: It is, uh, it was impressive to see her freak out about it. I was really happy, actually. That's my, that's my favorite Christmas movie. 

Hillary: Yeah, it's been interesting this year because my husband, I think, has decided to watch every version of a Christmas Carol that he can find.

I think I've watched it like eight times this season, all different everyone, a different version. And it's been really fun, but it's been really interesting too, to see how the, um, not only the costumes, but the story changes with every version. Yeah. And to see the differences in each of those, um, It's pretty cool.

Uh, some of them are amazing costumes and some of them not so much, but, um, yeah. It's, it's cool. How did we get onto 

Charity: costumes? Yeah, 

Kahle: because it makes, it makes it more believable. 

Hillary: Oh, that's right. It 

Charity: is the authentic realism. 

Hillary: No, that the costuming is something because I'm a seamstress because I love sewing clothes.

Um, that is something I try to use in my writing. I try to include that in my senses, you know, the whole. Investing people in the story. I don't know if it's necessarily making it believable, but it's pulling, I'm hopeful that it's pulling them in more and grounding them more on what's happening so that they can see that picture better in their head and clothing is something I try part of what I try and use to do that.

I think it's interesting to get, uh, use them get a fuller picture. I guess. 

Charity: That's really good. Yeah, believability. Did you want to say anything else about fantasy kale before we move on and we'll let Hillary cover romance? 

Kahle: Yes, I can. Um, I was just going to use an example from, from an adventure to get my players involved in a story that I wrote, um, before they went into the dungeon, there was like a travel sequence through a forest.

With a non-player character who was like guiding them and they stopped in this Grove, uh, and all the trees had parted and there was one big tree in the center and, uh, the person they were with approached the tree and like bowed to it, and then it turned and had to face and it allowed them to go, what is that?

And the way that D and D functions is somebody made a, a skill check of history and rolled to see if they knew anything about it. They rolled high enough. I said, here's what you know about what this might be. And so the party then understands like, Oh, wow, cool. If they would have rolled low, it would have been.

You have no idea what this does. What is your reaction to this? Yeah, that's one of the more improvisational aspects of it. It's, uh, a tool that I use a lot in, in tabletop gaming. So. 

Hillary: That's amazing. That's one of those things. When you say that kind of stuff, it makes me think of I'm writing a cozy mystery right now, and I finally have it piecing together and which is really good because the first chapter is due in like two days.

Um, but I'm working on this. And so I. I've just been thinking a lot about, um, doling out information. And when you talk about that, it just, it kind of struck me because I'm like man having to be an improvisational storyteller, like that is such an amazing skill. That's not something that I do well at all.

Like, um, Any kind of Bravo really would be so good. I'm terrible. You don't even know I can play the what if game, but it doesn't go anywhere. But it's amazing because just hearing, hearing you do that, I mean, I know you have some books and things, but you create a lot of these on your own, right? Yeah. You just sit and you tell the story and.

I think that's a really, that is evidence of a really natural ability to be able to Dole out information. The idea that you can have somebody say, okay, we have this level of a skill. And even being able to know how much information to tell them is so knowing like this is, this is the high level information.

This is the mid level. And being able to deal with that me I'm like. This is the information that we have

Charity: you with the suspense, because you have to do it in such small little amounts. To keep the suspense up. 

Hillary: It's killing me. It's killing me. So I'm yeah. Trying to figure out right now, how to keep secrets. That's not, that's not a natural talent, not a natural. 

Music: Hey, don't keep secrets.

So I'm working on it. It'll take a few drafts. It's a good thing. If 

Hillary: the novella, I just put my mom into a burning building today. It was great.

Music: I actually felt really good. And I was like, I just did something. Cool. 

Charity: Did you call your mom and say, Hey, did you smell smoke? 

Music: I did 

Hillary: not. I'm uh, I want to do actually, but I've been a little afraid to send it to her before I've got the whole thing finished. So yeah, people give feedback. If you give them, give them your story and I'm not ready for 

Music: feedback.

Charity: Well, I was thinking a little bit about science fiction and what makes that. Believable. And I do think there are levels because there are so many different kinds of science fiction. And so I think, you know, depending on what kind you write, I think there are slightly different levels of what you need, but obviously the basis of science fiction is that what if question?

But it has to be supported by the technology and like I write soft science fiction. Which allows me to kind of bring in my little elements that are more fantasy related. So I don't, you know, like mine is not hard science where you could go to a science textbook and go, Oh, this is, this is what's going on.

Um, but you know, Military Saifai I think you need to have some experience with military, so it needs to feel authentic and like, like someone understands that world. So I think there are lots of different things that, that are necessary to make it believable. And the biggest one for science fiction is technology and stuff.

Kahle: Yeah. That was something that you talked about with both Damien and Scott. Um, in the, in those interviews, Damien Larkin and Scott Kuhn, um, that was a cool thing because Damien had more, he 

Charity: had the military experience. 

Kahle: Yeah. So that was a very cool, uh, angle to hear. And to hear that, to hear that reemphasized again, to anybody out there doing science fiction, like don't be afraid to reach out to people who have that experience to get some information from them.

You don't have to just research in a book. There are plenty of people that want to share experiences and Hey, maybe they'll give you a story and you can get inspiration for your story, from what they have to say. 

Charity: We've all learned that you can't make stuff up. Like what actually happens sometimes. Life is stranger than fiction and you could end up with something amazing.

Yeah. Yeah. Um, I was gonna say after talking to Scott Kuhn and all of his talk about making sure you're backing things up with, with the science, I fell into that whole author imposter thing. I was like, Oh, I didn't do that. I didn't do that with any of my science fiction. I just told a story about these people.

And it was like fuzzy science over here. And I was like, Oh, that was like, I hope Scott never reads any of my stories.

Seriously. I'm like, okay, just get over it. I'm a different kind of writer. That's all 

Hillary: I was going to say. It's like you said though, it's a soft science fiction. I think yours works in that world because you do pull in those fantasy elements. So it's not just straight up contemporary and aliens. 

Charity: Yeah. Yeah.

And there is magic and magic is. 

Hillary: Yeah, amazing covers fills in the gaps. Those 

Charity: are the gaps and you know, and you have to have magic. If you have dragons, 

Music: sprinkle. 

Hillary: Yeah, no believability for me. I actually, I think it's interesting because you guys took it very much at a base genre level. Um, probably because we were talking about genres before that and I D I honestly was not thinking about that at all.

Um, so when it comes to, uh, romance or cozy mysteries being believable, I am I'm, I'm kind of on the fly here with that, but it, to me, it's about the, um, Uh, creating experiences and using those whole, the five senses and all of these things, because they're both contemporary, we're writing a world we already know and believe so, as long as you're not like throwing the rules around in that and people going, wait a minute, you know, um, It's more about making sure that your characters, uh, know what they're talking about that, um, I read something today where she was discussing some characters who were like, Oh, there's this fast moving river.

I don't know how to swim and I can't get over it. Lucky. I watched a video a week ago that taught me how to make a raft. And Hey, I have a Tomahawk right here in my backpack. Let's do this. And 

Music: it's like, exactly. Can't swim, but like of me, I can build myself a raft right on the fly. I haven't done it before.

So it's 

Hillary: just like making sure that you, if you needed your character to have a skill that making sure that we include those, uh, not that knowledge a little earlier, you know, that maybe this is something that's a passion of theirs, or maybe, you know, if they need to kick someone in the chin with their awesome karate moves that maybe they just brought home a little trophy for their karate thing at the beginning of the story or something, I thought it was.

I thought it was nice. So

Music: I just love the Tomahawk in my backpack 

Charity: because you know, we all 

Hillary: carry tomahawks in our backpacks. That is my contemporary toolkit right there. 

Charity: Well, I love to, um, in our texts, we were texting before getting onto podcasts. And you talked about dialogue. I think dialogue can, no matter what genre. The dialogue really has to feel like something you would hear, even if you're in fantasy or if it's historical, or if it's in the future, there are certain things that just, when you read it, you're like nobody talks like that.

Hillary: Well, and the other hard part about dialogue is sometimes, um, I mean, you hear, you've seen things where they're like, if I actually took a transcript of the conversation we just had and tried to put it into a book that would not work right. I mean, there's way too much, uh, half conversations, half sentences and things where people will be like so lost.

And there's a lot 

Charity: of physical cues that associate a conversation. 

Hillary: It's true. And we repeat ourselves and we talk about boring stuff in a book

we have to re yes or run-on sentences. Um, in order for it to be believable, it does have to be a little bit more concise. It has to help our brains keep moving through that conversation quickly so that we can keep hold of the. Of the path that we've sent the button, you know, that the author has sent them on.

So I dunno, it's, it's tricky business, that dialogue 

Charity: stuff, but you're right. It is because it can make or break, you have to follow some rules, but still add in little snippets of what it would really feel like, 

Hillary: you know, well, and really knowing your genre makes a difference in that. I know, um, uh, Tamara Heiner wrote one where I was looking at it and I got done with a scene and the guy was sitting on the ground slipping through his phone, like watching for someone to call.

And I don't remember what he said, but it was just like, it was something that was so real that I was just like, we don't see this in books ever. You know, they don't sit there and watch the phone like this. And. The whole rest of the story had nothing like that. You know, it was, it was contemporary, but it's just like, there was just this moment that I was like, I could see myself doing that.

And it's taking these moments that we see in our real lives that, you know, if you're, I guess, thinking about your story and what that character is going through and what would I actually be doing, um, being able to pull those real life moments into your books, I think is pretty amazing. 

Charity: And then the reader makes a connection.

Like you made a connection with that character. That's what 

Hillary: writing does, making connections. 

Music: Good job. You found her grounding point, 

Charity: make that connect. It's a new year. We have new goals. You've got this, you know, suspense that you've got to get out this year. Hillary. What are some of your other goals? Just broad general.

We won't get specific till next time, but what would you like to happen for you as a writer in 2021? 

Hillary: I just I'm, I'm trying to get more familiar with my writing, my style of writing so that I can get through my stories quicker. Um, that is my goal, I guess. And I've kind of, I suppose you can say I've been doing that.

Um, last year I only got one story written this year. I've gotten. Two and a half. 

Music: So I, more than doubled lips. See, that's great, but 

Hillary: I'm hoping that as I keep doing this, you know, I'm going to be able to get faster and get better. And I have big plans and big goals, and I am excited to be working on them.

Charity: That's excellent. How about you, kale? 

Kahle: My goals with writing include, uh, Basically doing it. I mean, really? I just need to, uh, do it so that I can find more things to work on. 

Charity: See, and it's so hard for you. Like I know for me when I started, I was a stay at home mom, so yes, even though I had little kids and I was busy, I could carve out 10 minutes while I'm sitting in the school.

Drive through line and scribble something. You know, whenever we were sitting at the doctor's office, I could scribble something. You know, if they were taking a nap, I could get in half an hour. So even though it wasn't ideal, I could steal those moments, but you have a regular job and then you come home and you have to be with your family.

So it's a little harder for you to figure out what that's going to look like. 

Hillary: How long have you been writing charity 

Charity: seriously for like, when I got serious about writing, it's been 12 years. 

Hillary: How long have you been writing? Oh, 

Charity: wow. 18 years. 

Hillary: Okay. So she's been from the beginning. It took her six years to get serious.

And it's been 12 years since then. And she's got a ton, a ton of stuff out there now. Um, so keep that in mind. As she has given this, as she's talking about this, these are the little pieces and things that we can do, but, and yes, it's going to be hard to find time to do that kind of stuff. But even when you do it takes time and you build up to that.


Kahle: Yeah. And, and I, you know, I, I know that it's hard for me to. Well, not that I, it is hard for me to, to focus and, and right, because I like to have a lot of time because 10 minutes here and there is hard. Oh, that's, that's harder for me than finding two hours to write, honestly, because 10 minutes turns into two hours really fast.


I have to budget. Right, right. But, um, you know, one of my, one of my overall goals this year is to, uh, to start saying, I'm going to do things instead of saying, I want to do things like that and say, yeah, I'm going to do this. And try to drive that accountability home more. I, I say it a lot, but there's a, there's an invisible want in inside of when I say I'm going to do stuff right now, I want to say, I'm going to do that and then do that.

Charity: So maybe you need to say I will. Yeah. And then follow with, fill in 

Kahle: the blank. Yeah. With, with as, as few words as possible after that. So I can have a concrete task. 

Hillary: Yeah. I actually had a class that I was working on when I thought I might actually teach a class at the conference this fall. And, uh, basically it was just the, I think the title is just, I am a writer and it was basically talking about how saying those words can change your life, you know, going from, I want to do this, or maybe I just, I don't know if I can do this.

I think it's a good idea to actually saying I am a writer will change the way you look at what you do and who you are. Yeah. 

Charity: And kale, you are a writer because you write stories for your D and D team all the time. 

Hillary: Yeah. 

Music: We need 

Charity: to play to play and be so fun. 

Kahle: Well, charity, how about yourself? 

Charity: Um, I have sets of probably very unrealistic the goals for myself this year, but I figure if you don't set big goals, then you know, at least if I'm reaching for this high goal, I will at least come halfway, which will be an improvement over last year.

Um, so yeah, my biggest goal though, is I have to finish book 

Hillary: three of.

Charity: The magic wake series. It is long overdue and there's no excuse. It's half, I've got almost 50,000 words written. I just have to sit down and do it. Um, and then that's the biggest one. If that's all I do, I'll be happy. But then I also have that four book romance series.

So I've got a science fiction goal and I have a romance goal and romance go for me. Yep. Four books series. Kale's making faces, but I've been trying to reprocess the idea and train my brain to think romance, keep it simple, stupid, you know, so kiss, keep it simple, stupid, you know, um, because romance, you only need the one, maybe a little half side thread, you know, don't, don't make it too complicated.

They're all mapped out. And so the first book is needs one chapter. That was my goals, you know, October, November, um, the discovering her heart with Kristin, she needs the final chapter in that book will be done. So if those were the only two books I put out next year, I'll be happy. But the goal is to do all four of those romance by the end of the year, that's 12 months.

So. That's 

Hillary: well, yeah, in reality, I have goals to finish. I think 22 books 

Charity: next this year, 2021, 

Hillary: 12 of them are develop 12 days of Christmas. Okay. Yes, I want that. But it still breaks down to like, I have a five book series that I want to at least get a good check 

Music: of. I 

Hillary: know a lot of, there's a five book series that I want to write and.

What was the other ones that I was counting? Um, I, my, so the motorcycle romance, the 12 days of Christmas at 17, and then I was.

Charity: You need to make a list. Seriously, you need to make a list, put all your ideas on the list. You will be shocked all 

Hillary: summer. And I, I 

Charity: honestly just forgot what my other ones were that I was talking about. So whatever I filled a page, I was like, this is insane. I have to get them done because that's why I can't think, 

Hillary: Oh, Oh.

I also have a couple of co of cozy mysteries that I have to do. Yeah. So one that actually has to be done. Two that pretty much have to be done. And three, the third one is, uh, it would be really good if that would 

Charity: so poor kale. This is your future. Watch it, allow yourself to start writing the ideas will overwhelm you and you will be like 30 bucks this year.

And then you'll get two of them done. And you'll be like 

Hillary: to get more than two drinks. I got two done this year, so I need more than that next year.

Charity: Life is hard

graft, all four of them this year, the next year released like five books. But yeah, so. I think this is what I love about our group. We've got kale at the beginning. Who's still trying to figure it out what it's going to look like and how he's going to do it. But it's set desires there. We've got Hillary, who's got her feet, both theater in the water and she's like, Oh, I'm waiting out.

Getting wasted. And then I'm just like, 

Music: I'm drowning.

Charity: I 

Hillary: love the way you said that because the description you gave of Kayla, I'm like, that sounds exactly like me right now. Trying to figure out what's going on, what I'm doing and pushing forward. 

Charity: You do have both feet in the water, 

Music: you're at least up to your shins. 

Charity: You got to own it. Hillary,

Hillary: I go dance in the water. 

Charity: Cal still looking at the Lake going mad. I know about 

Music: this and I'm trying 

Charity: desperately to swim back to shore. 

Hillary: I don't know. I think he's dipping his toes in there. It's called a God. You being like 

Music: he's in his hands. 

Charity: Maybe.

Music: She's like, what are you talking about?

Charity: Like here's what he is.

Kahle: Did I get any writing done this week? Uh, the writing that I got done was for an art project. For my, uh, my board game. So I did some mountains and some little forests 

Hillary: that people can all sorts of 

Kahle: little pieces. And, uh, yeah, so I'm, I'm getting all of that figured out and. 

Charity: Uh, everybody 

Kahle: writing, writing the rules and the process for the game.

Charity: Yeah. So tell everybody what you're doing because our listeners are going to have no idea what you're talking about. What are you doing? Kale? What is this game? I am 

Kahle: making a, I am making a hex crawl, uh, tabletop game. Um, That is sort of like a combination between, so it looks like settlers of Catan because it's hex, it's hexagon pieces, but it's, it plays more like, um, betrayal at house on the Hill.

Combined with bang combined with, um, I forgot the other game, but 

Charity: in all of his other spirits are really fun, which is awesome. 

Music: That's very cool. 

Charity: He's just going to like fly by us Hillary once he gets going.

Music: Okay. Just on it, kale. I'm awesome. 

Charity: I can do anything. Say it. Oh man. You gotta say it. Can you now. 

Kahle: I have some potential potential. 

Music: Thanks

very much. 

Charity: I guess the only other thing like goal-wise is I really want to, um, continue. Kind of us meeting and doing our podcasts because I love doing it with you guys. I do want to add like one kind of informational a little more, like here's, here's some tips on how to do this craft thing. Like once a month.

Yes. Kale. He's raising his hand as I was. I can't see.

Kahle: What do you think about doing a song challenge every month? I love 

Hillary: it. I do too. It was really fun. I was actually thinking about that after we did it, I had Allie do it. I gave it to her and she did it and I thought I was just thinking it would be really fun to keep doing this. 

Kahle: Okay. Yeah. Who wants to choose the next song?


Charity: I choose a song? I'll email you the song I have. I have a list of them. Maybe our listeners would like to do it with us. So listeners, I will post the song and Facebook on our Facebook group. Yes. Loosely author. What fruit paint and I'll put a link. That'll 

Music: be the easiest thing. I'll kind of leave.

that page? The one that I posted. 

Charity: Yes, I'll definitely post it below. Or you can just go to facebook.com backslash loose leaf podcasts, and that's where you'll find the song. You can listen to it and take the challenge with us. Well, 

Kahle: keep writing 

Music: for star.